Steve,

I know you've been doing some flying in gliders, it would be cool to hear a little about that. Do you have any pics or video?

Here is an amazing gliding video:



I've been gliding in Condor a bit over the years, and just got back into it . . .it is one of the best flight models around in any sim, and still is. Of course with gliders there is a lot more to the weather effects on the aircraft, and as I know you know, FSX doesn't do any good with this. I tried Silent wings demo a few years ago, it was pretty good, but the best is still Condor. You might wanna get it! Unlike FSX it models winds over slopes, waves, differential surface heating rather than random thermals, pressure gradients, thermals that are dynamic, and based on the weather, as well as a kick butt flight model. There is a fairly dedicated online community of people who race, do aerobatics, or just cruise. I flew a race last night. . .maybe speeds never get higher than 280kmh but there is nothing boring about flying amongst the alps looking for the best line with the best lift with no engine to bail you out. . .that's for sure!

http://www.condorsoaring.com/

Some videos:
Condor Challenge:


S!

TX-EcoDragon
Black 1
TX-Squadron XO

How much does Condor cost Eco?  That looks fun!Regards,TX-Rahman"BLACK 4"

Rahman, Condor is 40 Euros to download [from the Condor site, but it's 49.99 at http://www.fspilotshop.com/product_info.php?products_id=438 ]; 50Euros if you want the CD.  Silent Wings is 69 Euros (US$100).Eco, yes, I do have some pics and video of my sailplane rides.  I'll attach some pics later when I'm not so tired... Don't have a server to upload any video to though.  I just have about 5 minutes of video total, so far.I didn't realize you were flying Condor, Eco... I've been trying to make up my mind for awhile as to which sim to buy.  I think presently, Silent Wings has really caught up to Condor in many aspects, and in some cases is better than Condor.From browsing the user forums of both sims, it seems that the only real advantage Condor has, is the popularity and infrastructure of it's online tournaments.Silent Wings, seems to have better graphics, and more scenery for cross country flying.  If nothing else, Silent Wings supports all 6DOF with TrackIR, where as Condor only supports 2DOF (like IL-2).  Another advantage Silent Wings has (at least on my system); is that I can use the maximum resolution with my TrippleHead2Go system (3840x1024); where as Condor only supports 1920x640.I may buy Condor too, if for no other reason, than to join the competitions and/or fly with you guys. I just bought Silent Wings over the weekend, just to have something to practice with that's more realistic than FSX.  Although, nothing beats the graphics on FSX--sigh.TX-ScubaSteveWhite 4

OK, here's some pics.  This first one is of me taking off for an introductory flight back in February in an ASK-21. Not the best day for soaring, but what the hell.  My instructor that day, has flown gliders since she was 14.  TSA is the second largest sailplane club in the country, and is unique in that the club owns its own airport.  Rates, are pretty low... as low as $7/hr and $25 per tow to 2,000'AGL.

This pic is of my Dad strapped in.

A more typical lineup during the summer

Getting ready for launch...

One of the club's three tow planes
TX-ScubaSteveWhite 4

Thanks for the pics Steve. . .you can host video on youtube, or the TX ftp. Those are nice looking planes, it looks like a nice place to fly, and those are great rates! At 7/hour you can log some serious time for next to nothing if there is lift out there. . .how's the thermalling there?There sure isnt much headroom in there is there? Your dad looks about as tall as you could be and still fit. . . and any negative G flight wouldn't work for him. I see you are all wearing chutes. . .did you guys get the aerobatic treatment?As far as Silent Wings, I just got the current demo. I tried it 3 or 4 years ago and while it was nice, it didn't have the flight modeling of condor, and it only had satellite scenery so it looked good only at high altitudes, and lacked any actual ground object details. Today, the online racing is actually pretty fun to me. . .I'm nowhere near as fast as the veterans, but I finish the courses which is better than many of the guys!Some threads on the topic of condor vs SW etc:http://silentwings.no/phpbb2/viewtopic/?t=107Oh, and for those who haven't tried either and would like to see a better sim than FSX without dropping the cash just yet grab the SW demo: http://www.silentwings.no/article/articleview/55S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

Well, To me SilentWings feels much more FSX like. In the plus category I like that SW displays roads (thought they are ugly) so that you can use them for VFR pilotage, I also like the clouds of SW a little more than Condor. . .as you fly into them they are more like flying into real clouds. They look better from a distance too, though they are rather uniform. They remind me of a mix of MSFS clouds mixed with IL-2 clouds. 6DOF in Silent wings is nice, mostly since I can zoom in on the panel. Even if they don't bother with 6DOF it'd be nice to get at least the zoom feature added to Condor TrackIR capability. The canopy has dynamic reflections which are sorta neat. The Flight model is much more simplified than in Condor, as is the weather. There is no wave modelling in Silentwings, thermals are less logically placed (ie they seem to be based on something other than the terrain over which they exist many times) and yet it seems rather easy to find ridge lift even where you wouldn't really expect it. Stalls, at least in the demo flyable"twin" are not even modelled, and aerobatics are no more possible than in the FSX 172. Adverse yaw is much reduced, and the same sort of peculiar oscillation on the yaw axis that plagues MSFS is in SW as well so coordinated turns are a little off. The autogen type trees are placed in the middle of runways, roads, and lakes. . .the terrain textures are blurry goo until you are at least 2000 feet over them. Airports are dead environments with no buildings, other aircraft, or runway taxiway textures. There are some odd sunken runways in the Minden tahoe are too. So far I tend to like to fly just above ridges and along slopes skimming the ground more than I like high altitude thermalling. For this sort of flying, it's condor all the way, for the high altitude stuff, SW does well also, and the terrain and roads looks good at that height. Also SW has larger maps so really long flights are better suited to SW, though Condor maps are plenty big IMHO. I wish someone would make the Rockies or Sierras for Condor. . .SW has some US scenery which is sort of nice to have. For those that like photoreal scenery Condor has a few of those too (one I posted above). Overall, I would easily give the nod to Condor. That's before the Condor multiplayer race features, and the PDA gps system, the MC theory computer, and thermal visualizations are pretty nice in condor. I've been having fun with the multiplayer races, it would be doubly cool to have a TUSA/TX race team (Condor has a built in team scoring feature).S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

I too noticed that SW didn't seem much more different than FSX's flight model, but figured maybe I just wasn't observant enough to notice the fine nuances that others seemed to notice.  I was dissapointed that I couldn't seem to spin any of the gliders, (as apparently you can according to one demo video I saw); but figured maybe I hadn't figured out how to load the CG far enough aft, to get a full stall in the first place.One other thing I like about SW's visuals, is that besides being able to lean forward with TrackIR, you can also double click on an instrument, and it will pop up as a larger 2D gauge so it's easier to read.  Perhaps that might be a annoying on a single monitor, but with three monitors it still leaves you plenty of room to see outside.  Yeah, the dynamic reflections in SW are kind of cool.I don't know if Condor has a winch launch, but in SW it's quite an experience.  It's amazing how fast you climb with that.  You can get 3,000' AGL in about a minute or two!  It also has a powered glider, which is fun to operate.  However, ground handling is very difficult, as the rudder seems to have way more effect than it could possibly have IRL.I do believe that SW has moutainwaves--at least they talk about them on the forums, and when turning thermal cheat on, I could see the wind vector arrows making wave like patterns over the Sierra's at lake Tahoe.  Wind vectors and thermal graphics seem pretty neat, but I agree, Eco, that the location of thermals seems to be more or less random.  So, that's cool that Condor does a better job modelling that.I know there's at least one airport in the Alps scenery that has buildings and such... but big whoop! LOL.I've read, that SW does a better job with the tow planes.  I know it models wake turbulence--have practiced "boxing around the prop-wash".  The towplanes (unlike FSX) also tend to manoever around terrain and obstacles, and they can also be directed in any direction you wish.I definitely find it more interesting to soar close to a ridge, than up high in a thermal--one reason I wish I could be soaring out near Lake Tahoe, instead of out here in flat TX! :)Well, with your well written review Eco, I'm buying and downloading Condor TONIGHT!I think it would be awesome if TX and TUSA could form a soaring squad on Condor!TX-ScubaSteveWhite 4

I think youll like it Steve. . and if you like aerobatics, you will love it.As far as waves, and SW developer said that they hope to have it in a future version, but don't now. Not that it's the end of the world.now, this is a little silly. . .but don't let it dissuade you:I've found a mountain face that when the wind kicks up is good for an amazing udraft. . .so strong in fact that some guys in a multiplayer session were losing total control. . .that's how I found the face in the first place. I decided to find the mountain in my Fox aerobatic glider, and have some fun. Here is a quick capture of something kinda interesting. i thought I would just get a looong downline with lots of spins right next to the face. . .I got that. . .but. . .with a twist! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikodGUD3Lf4S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

The link to the forum that  you provided is actually a couple years old.  I think since then, they've put Mountainwaves in, but in any case, I've got Condor--just about to install it.TX-ScubaSteveWhite 4

Ahhh. . .I guess the folks at flightsim.com might need to be updated on that!I see that you were on HISTORIA coms but didn't see you in time to say hello.I'm about to head in for a race, if you are still up, check in again!S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

OK, here's the links to the videos.  Thanks for your help, Eco.I took these videos with a compact digital camera, so it doesn't have much for zoom ability.This first one may seem like I'm showing a lot of clouds, but trying to show other sailplanes flying nearby.
ftp://69.56.198.2/Full%20Scale%20Flying/TSA/ASK-21%20Instructor.wmv
The second is showing us on downwind, for a landing.
ftp://69.56.198.2/Full%20Scale%20Flying/TSA/ASK-21%20Landing.wmv
TX-ScubaSteveWhite 4

There is a dedicated server component included with condor. . I don't think there are any US based dedicated servers. . .hmmmm.S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

Just realized I never responded to your earlier post, Eco... Yeah, the rates are really cheap--partly because the club made some good investments in the past, and partly because all members are expected to volunteer--so, getting flight instruction is free--other than the rental.  One factor that isn't so obvious initially, is that when renting a club glider (unless you have it checked out for a cross country); you're limited to flying for one hour at a time, unless there's no one on the ground waiting their turn.  The club has about 4 trainers, and 7 or 8 single seaters--I'm not sure.  So, anyway, by being limited to one hour at a time, you end up spending more with additional tows.The thermalling is ok I suppose.  I haven't had enough experience nor talked to enough people to get a fair idea yet... but I've gotten the impression that there are plenty of thermal deveolpment... However, because of the high humidity in this area, most cloud bases are around 4,000 to 7,000 feet... so that's usually about as high as you can expect to get--since we don't have any slopes around here.  Some people have gotten up above 10,000... but most people seem to just enjoy the challenge of flying cross countries.  You may never get high, but there seems to be a lot of thermals to pick from on a good summer day.No, there certainly isn't much headroom, but so far it hasn't been any issue for me.Yes, we always wear chutes.  Club policy.  One of the members is a certified parachute packer, and so he does all the inspections and repacking every 60 days.Only did a loop once with an instructor--as we were flying back to the field, she asked me if I would mind if she did a loop, and I told her to please be my guest.  I think we pulled about 4Gs, but I still thought I was going to die... a little different than looping in a sim.  In any case, I do hope to get some training in aerobatics.S!TX-ScubaSteveWhite 4

Still sounds like a pretty good setup Steve. . . even at 32/hour. I bet once you get solo and have the single seaters to choose from it's alot easier to schedule. . .it usually helps to go during the week too.So it turns out that the CG shifts aft when moving the slider to the left, to negative values. . .even though power planes usually have the CG aft of the datum and register - values as a forward shift and + as negative. Oh well, in any case, don't spin the LS8 or Discus at aft CG with water onboard or you're in for a ride!!Also, today I ran that Eastern Alps (Uwe-Schweiz) course we flew yesterday but in the LS8s with a nice aft CG and it moves out better than the Discus2c. . .I posted my best speed today by a fair margin, and it was my first flight in that plane. . . 192.5 km/h average speed and second place out of 5, with two who landed out and did not finish.Compare that to the previous runs in the Discus:http://213.183.93.145/condor/pilotinfo.php?pilot=Brett.GoldsmithIt seems like the plane pack adds some much faster gliders. . .I guess that's why most people buy it. . .it seems like the first place guys are usually in the ASG29.  S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

Well darn. . .I see a few of us could have saved a few bucks(assuming no tax). Condor for 49.99: http://www.fspilotshop.com/product_info.php?products_id=438The plane pack is two bucks cheaper at 13.99http://www.fspilotshop.com/product_info.php?products_id=1207S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

Video: The Essence of Condor: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9pAjqiRg3c&mode=related&search=S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

Well that Awesome!!! ;)-GOZR

Well guys. . I've installed Condor on the TX-Server, and have a test rotation up right now. . it works great and the guys that joined, from around the world had nice stable pings to it. . .of course.King and I ran a race along with the other guys. . .we didn't quite win, but were happy to have a nice US based server to fly on. S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

I ran into a tree, but at least these trees aren't invisible trees.

That's awesome TX has a condor server running! :)  Thanks Eco.Kingsnake, you even ran into VISIBLE trees?!!    Just struck me as funny... Normally the excuse would be, "but they were invisible!!!"I hit one too, that was quite visible with my two beady eyes, while flying with Eco, trying to scrape some lift off a small hill... my excuse: the aspect ratio doesn't help, especially if you're used to flying the stubbied winged I-16. (which I really can't claim, since I never got that used to flying the I-16 anyway).It was all in a long series of crashes: usually as a result of tearing my wings off when my IAS approached that red line thing... thus leading to poor Eco graciously restarting, so we could try the course all over again.TX-ScubaSteveWhite 4

I'ts been populated all day. . .people seem to like it!S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO

Awesome guys!!!!Regards,TX-Rahman"BLACK 4"

It's been populated pretty much all night, and still is. It's hard to even get in there! I monitored the bandwidth usage overnight and it's minimal running DSHelper and one instance of the Condor Dedicated Server. . .hardly even a tangible blip on the DUMeter Radar. Using DSHelper I can run multiple servers by adding additional instances of the Dedicated Server, and only one instance of DSHelper. I'll give that a go tonight.In the mean time, now that I see I've got it all setup (other than a webpage for stats) it's time to tweak the tasks a little.S!TX-EcoDragonBlack 1TX-Squadron XO